"I can only hope that music today can turn around full circle and return to that type of mindset. Today it’s more visual and not as creative for the most part."

Johnny "V" Vernazza: Slides With The Truth

Johnny "V" Vernazza has played guitar with many Blues greats like Chicago guitarist Luther Tucker, Sunnyland Slim, Chuck Berry, Steve "Guitar" Miller, Greg Allman, George Thorogood, Charlie Daniels, Nick Gravenites, Commander Cody & the Lost Planet Airmen and Elvin Bishop to name a few. Johnny was recruited into Elvin Bishop's band that led to 6 albums, Gold Records, endless touring and the #3 song in the nation by 1974 "Fooled Around and Fell in Love."  That record turned Gold as well as a LP with "The Marshall Tucker Band" that featured Johnny and Elvin on slide guitar. Johnny continues to wow folks with his sizzling bluesy slide guitar as a longtime member of harmonica great Norton Buffalo. So keep an eye and ear out for Johnny as he's playin', producing and recording with some of the best the music world has to offer.

Johnny Vernazza was born in San Francisco and raised in Daly City. As we all know, the San Francisco Bay Area in the 1960's was a hotbed of music. Clubs were everywhere and to go out and jam at four or five clubs a night was the norm, not to mention the Fillmore, Avalon Ballroom and concerts in Golden Gate Park. Starting out playing guitar in 1963, Johnny Vernazza also played bass for a time with a rock band that worked the Fillmore and toured as the opening act for Quicksilver Messenger Service, War, and Big Brother and the Holding Company. About 1970, he joined the gospel band" Gideon and Power", which toured the United States, and appeared on the Sonny & Cher Summer Show on NBC TV.

As the blues scene gathered national and international momentum, Johnny "V" was playing with blues greats such as Luther Tucker and Sunnyland Slim. Around that same time he was holding court with a blues band in San Francisco's North Beach with former Elvin Bishop member Perry Welsh. Elvin would come in and jam towing along the likes of Paul Butterfield and other blues monsters. It wasn't long after that Elvin asked Johnny to join the new band he was putting together, the rest is history. Elvin and Johnny's dual lead and slide parts set a style that was part of the Southern Rock Sound and continues to live on today.

Interview by Michael Limnios

What do you learn about yourself from the blues and what does the blues mean to you?

I learned to be true to myself when I played, to sound like “me” not someone else. I always took a little here and there from “Muddy”, etc., but never copied what they played. The blues means truth to me, as naked as one can be musically.

How do you describe Johnny Vernazza sound and progress, what characterize your music philosophy?

I like a strong heavy sound. Comes from my rock days in the late 60’s. Even my acoustic playing is strong and hard most the time. There are times when you “speak” softly or sexy and then my touch changes. It’s like having a conversation; you choose your words to express yourself. I love almost all music, opera, old country, soul and R&B. My philosophy is to learn as much as I can from all genres of music and then channel that into your playing.

"Well I think things always are in evolution and music indeed expresses every thing in culture, from politics to sex drugs and Rock & Roll. That generation listened to everything and blues became a very interesting genre for a lot of us." (Photo: Johnny & Norton Buffalo)

Which is the most interesting period in your life? Which was the best and worst moment of your career?

I would have to say from 1968 through the 70’s.

I have to answer this question in reverse! The worst moment was in 1987 when Norton Buffalo let me go from his band because of my alcohol and substance abuse, which came inches from ending my life and career. The best was when Norton, in 1993, hired me back. He was a great friend, musician and we had some of the best times on and off stage from 1980 until his passing in 2009. Having twenty-five years of sobriety now makes me look back at those years with a clear mind no regrets.

Which meetings have been the most important experiences for you? What is the best advice ever given you?

I met Elvin (Bishop) a few times before we hit it off. I think the first big band meeting we had when we signed with Capricorn records was one that really started things off. There where others before and after, but that one really comes to mind. We met at a very nice restaurant on Lombard Street in San Francisco and had a four coarse dinner drinks, etc. Elvin and our road manager at the time began to lay out the deal with the recording contract as well as the upcoming record. We also learned about the coming tour that followed the first record. It was a big night!

Don’t marry that gal! Really, that came from Elvin and he was right. The best advice I gave myself about 1965, shut up and listen if you want to be the best player on stage. It’s all eyes and ears, so pay attention cause it’s not always about you. It’s always about the band and playing with others. It doesn’t matter if you’re a sideman or it’s your show, if you don’t listen and work as a team, you will compromise your performance.

"I learned to be true to myself when I played, to sound like 'me' not someone else. I always took a little here and there from 'Muddy', etc., but never copied what they played. The blues means truth to me, as naked as one can be musically."

Are there any memories from Luther Tucker and Sunnyland Slim which you’d like to share with us?

Luther was one of the nicest people I’ve ever worked with and a lot of folks don’t know his history. He was in the trenches with all of Chicago’s royalty from the start of the blues scene there. I had the pleasure of playing both bass and guitar for him before I met Elvin. We had some great shows and that’s where I met and played with Sunnyland. One time I was hanging with Luther at his house in Hunters Point in San Francisco. We were walking back to his house after having some lunch at a soul food joint nearby. In the middle of our conversation he asked, “Johnny, would you do me a favor?” I said sure Tuck what is it? He says “When we rehearse later today, would you fire the band for me?” I laughed; he was such a nice cat he didn’t want to hurt any ones feelings. When we rehearsed later that day I just told the drummer and bass player Luther was switching things up, he smiled. Sunnyland I first met in Luther’s garage, yeah we were there a lot, and he was sitting at the piano playing some unbelievable barrelhouse blues piano. I’ll never forget that sound, he was all over the keyboard and it was soulful dripping with attitude and swagger. One of the gigs we did together was in Berkley, Ca. I can’t remember the club’s name, but it was next to a small diner. Me, Tuck and Sunnyland stopped in to get a bite to eat before the show. Sunnyland kept filling his coffee from a whiskey bottle in his jacket pocket. That night he got pretty lit up and while playing Luther’s tune “War Boy” I turned to Sunnyland and said  “E minor” as the song is in the key of E minor. He looked at me with this snarly smile and just kept pounding away on those major chords! They do not make them like this anymore, I repeat they do not! These cats could play with a feeling that is imitated but seldom heard or seen anymore.

What do you miss most nowadays from the 60s & 70s? What are your hopes and fears for the future of music?

Well, everything! That was a couple of decades that we will not see again soon. I feel very fortunate to have played music and developed my skills in that era. Musically things were far different than today, we wrote our own music, played our own music and performed our own music! There was so much artistic creativity and energy at the period of time. Even though record companies made a lot of the money and managers and agents ran amuck, there were all kinds of opportunity for us. You just had to be at the right place at the right time and be prepared. Try and tell that to musicians today and they think all we can do is remenis about a lost time, like it never happened!  If you were there you understood and we appreciated what the cats like Elvin Bishop (photo), Nick Gravenites and all the other blues guys did for us by paving that road that we were driving on and still driving on today. I can only hope that music today can turn around full circle and return to that type of mindset. Today it’s more visual and not as creative for the most part. You have artists and bands make it fast and then their gone or on to more “marketing” than performing. All about the money and not the art, it used to be about both with the art coming first.

Which memories from the Fillmore, Avalon Ballroom and concerts in Golden Gate Park makes you smile?

I played the Fillmore with my rock band Fox in 1969 we opened for “Free”. About four years later when I was playing with Elvin, Bill Graham not only remembered me but my name as well. Now that’s a man to contend with. He was a great man and always made you feel right at home. Of course I never had to deal with him on a business level and I know he was a tough cat. The band Fox never played the Avalon Ballroom, but we rehearsed there as our drummer worked for Chet Helms for a while. That’s when I got to see “Howlin’ Wolf” do sound check, wow! Golden Gate Park we played a bunch and it was always special. Me and my pals cut high school daily and lived in the park. At that time it was empty during the week. So playing there on the weekends for the concerts was like playing in your back yard.

Played some great shows in S.F. but my best memories took place at Wumper’s Old Man on Grant St. in San Francisco’s North Beach district1971 to ’73. The music we put down there at that time was raw  R&B and Blues. We were part of that group of upcoming bands around that played old style blues and R&B rearranging tunes to make them our own. Elvin, Tower of Power, Cold Blood, all the bands around that loved blues and R&B did this in one way or the other.

"All music is really quite connected if you take a look at it without being a freak on any one type of music. Blues, Gospel and country all about the same when you get down to it. Southern Rock added a “jam” effect to it." 

What was the reason that made the 60s generation to start the searching about the Blues and Roots music?

Well I think things always are in evolution and music indeed expresses every thing in culture, from politics to sex drugs and Rock & Roll.

That generation listened to everything and blues became a very interesting genre for a lot of us. Bill Graham (and other promoters of that time) played a big part in that, as you would go to see shows that had The Jefferson Airplane and Albert King on the same bill. Taj Mahal and The Sons of Champlin, the list went on. The Stones had a lot to do with exposing American youth to it’s own heritage, imagine that.

Are there any memories from Nick Gravenites and Elvin Bishop, which you’d like to share with us?

A lot in fact too much! Touring and recording for those years with Elvin would, and some day will, fill a book and they’re all good as we had a great time on and off stage. Elvin was a big brother to me and we played, wrote, fished and partied and had quite a good time over all. I would run into Nick at Janis Joplin’s house in Larkspur in late ’69 early 70 but that was always just a party. I think my best memories of Nick was in the North Beach days at Wumpers Old Man on Grant St. about 1972. Nick would come by and sit in with the band and just make shit up, some of the best lyrics ever!  I had just started playing guitar again with the band “Perry and the Pumpers”. Perry had road managed and played harp with Elvin and when he left Elvin he started the Pumpers. We held court at Wumpers Old Man and word got out bringing Elvin, Nick, Paul Butterfield, Luther Tucker who ever else was in town drop by to jam. It was the place to be in North Beach. Elvin eventually stole myself and the bass player Michael “Fly” Brooks from Perry and that was the start of the Elvin Bishop Band.

"My philosophy is to learn as much as I can from all genres of music and then channel that into your playing." (Photo: Johnny with Nick Gravenites, Barry Goldberg and friends)

What are the lines that connect the legacy of Blues with Psychedelic and continue to Folk and Southern Rock?

All music is really quite connected if you take a look at it without being a freak on any one type of music. Blues, Gospel and country all about the same when you get down to it. Southern Rock added a “jam” effect to it. As they say the ride out of Wilson Picket’s cover of “Hey Jude” was the birth of Southern Rock, thanks to Duane Allman. Playing bass in the gospel band Gideon and Power for me was the perfect transition to the blues world, it paved my way. Elvin loved gospel and we listened to a lot of it! My slide guitar playing comes from a vocalist and sax players more than Elmore or Muddy, although they helped!

Part of this country (the south) had its own thing going on at the time. The sound that came out of there was a combo of blues, country and R&B. Players like Greg Allman pioneered that sound with his vocals and organ teamed with dual guitars that set the tone for Southern Rock. Funny, as when I joined Elvin I had only heard the Allman Bros. once and didn’t listen to much “current” music in those days. What we developed with Elvin was a version of our own sound that fit the Southern Rock pigeonhole. We had the same concept because Elvin and I loved country, blues, R&B and gospel, we fit right in.

Let’s take a trip with a time machine, so where and why would you really wanna go for a whole day..?

Just one day! I tell you what, drop me off in 1968 and pick me up sometime in the early 80’s and we’ll call it even. What a long cool trip it’s been!

How has the music changed over the years? Do you believe in the existence of real blues nowadays?

Music, as I look at it, is constantly evolving, as it should if it’s to continue being music. Over the years there is always a genre’ that I don’t like, disco, gansta rap, etc. That’s just part of the evolution and change, that’s a good thing. I hear songs I didn’t like thirty years ago and love now, it’s all up to your taste and moods.

There is real blues now days, but you have to search it out. Go to any town anywhere, in any country and hear the same blues set. What kills me is that folks think you can play a Muddy or BB King tune and your playing the blues. The song has nothing to do with it, it’s the passion, feeling the touch and interpretation the song to its fullest. You can do almost any thing if you “own” the tune when you play it. If you sing and play with everything you got with complete abandon of whose out there, what they think and whether they like it or not. Do all that right, they’ll like it!

Johnny "V" Vernazza - Official website